Ed's Franky (beneath the paint)

[Tone Slinger]

Here are a few pics of the grain differences between Ash and alder. There is much less discrepency between the grain/heartwood in Alder as compared to ash. These examples obviously arent of the exact grain, cuts and angles as Ed's two guitars, but give a general idea. First though, a little info on Ash-


HARD ASH VS SWAMP ASH

The word "swamp" does not refer to a species of wood but actually to a "zone" where ash grows. There are different ways to describe what is actually the same tree, which by growing in different areas of the USA (north or center or south) develops almost totally different characteristics. So we have "red ash" also known as "pumpkin ash" (fraxinux prufunda) which is what we guitar makers call "swamp ash", a
tree growing in the swamp areas of Mississippi and Alabama, and other heavier species such as green ash (Fraxinus Pennsylvanica, "white ash", Black Ash (Fraxinus Nigra), which are more common in the centre and in the north of the country.

Hard ash vs swamp ash
Ash tree.

All the above are actually names which are given to the same tree to distinguish the very different characteristics (weight, colour, density) the tree develops by growing in different areas and environmental conditions.

So is it the place where it grows that makes "swamp" ash so light? Possibly, but not only. Also, how and where the woodworker cutsthe blank from the tree has an importance.

CUTS: Everything else being the same, a cut in the upper part of the tree will result in a heavier blank of wood. Conversely, a piece of wood obtained from the lower part of the tree will be lighter. The rule here is that: the further north the ash tree grows, and the higher and the more internal the cut into the tree, the heavier the wood will be, and vice versa.

Swamp ash (tree and blanks).

Low cuts of heavy ash may weigh as much as upper cuts of swamp ash, and very external and low cuts of swamp ash may be so light that they weigh similar to basswood or even less and this is the reason for the great confusion there is on this subject.

[popskull]

Thanks for the info and pics--I too think the bare wood gtr is Franky

[garbeaj]

I agree that the sunburst strat theory has been decimated once and for all!

Compare the grain patterns...

...cased closed?

I have been looking at these two and I really can't see how the sunburst strat could be the same guitar as the unfinished Franky.

There is a "V" pattern in the grain on both guitars, but the bottom line of the "V" on the sunburst strat cuts through the jackplate near the top.

The bottom line of the "V" pattern in the unfinished Franky cuts through at just past the midpoint of the jackplate.

Admittedly, I'm not as good at seeing these types of things as you are...what do you think?

[Strat78]

Jimi posted those pics to show just how completely deferent they are. Remember this guy:

FACTS: The EVH 61 SB Fender Strat body is the same body as the EVH black strat. The EVH Black Strat is the same body as the EVH Black and White Striped Strat. The EVH Black and White Striped strat is the same body as the EVH Black, White and Red Strat. There is no doubt, no mistake, no debate, no argument. Those are the simple and undisputable hard cold FACTS!

Well, If he has not already, I guess the honorable thing to do now would be to stick his head in the nearest oven.

[garbeaj]

Jimi posted those pics to show just how completely deferent they are. Remember this guy:

FACTS: The EVH 61 SB Fender Strat body is the same body as the EVH black strat. The EVH Black Strat is the same body as the EVH Black and White Striped Strat. The EVH Black and White Striped strat is the same body as the EVH Black, White and Red Strat. There is no doubt, no mistake, no debate, no argument. Those are the simple and undisputable hard cold FACTS!

Well, If he has not already, I guess the honorable thing to do now would be to stick his head in the nearest oven.

Hah! Well said! That unfinished Franky pic is fucking monumental...certainly the coolest thing since I found the color pics of the white Destroyer, but obviously even more important because it deals with the Frankenstein.

One thing that does appear to be sure is that Ed was using the same rosewood board strat neck with the oddly placed Fender logo on both the sunburst strat and the Jenny Lens black strat and one assumes the unfinished Franky...if only one could see the headstock on that unfinished Franky pic.

This all seems to point to a rosewood neck for the demos? Possibly the recording of the first album? I would say it is more likely for the demos, but who knows?

[fivecoyote]

Dont think it's been said yet but gotta note that Ed said he got an unpainted body (Frank), then painted it himself. Very much doubt that he would've painted it vintage burst then stripped it!

[garbeaj]

The bare Franky in the below pic is a two piece center seam ash build. I can decipher by the grain that the 'end grain' pattern at the join is an 'A'. Meaning at the join the growth rings get bigger to smaller from the bottom of the body to the top. The VHII 'studio' Strat/Dano neck is center seamed the opposite way ('V' at the end grain join/seam).

What does this mean ? Well for one a two piece, center seam is a preffered construction from a rigidity perspective (counter warping) and Two, it has better 'resonant draw' because the seam is right in the middle of the bridge up through the neck pocket, which are very important areas in regards to resonance. Obviously densities within same species wood affect things too, but the ring orientation is an absolute in terms of effect on sound. So, regardless of ring orientation,tighter rings with tighter curve are denser and are from the upper tree height and will be heavier/denser (brighter), wider rings with less curve are obviously from the lower regions and are less dense/heavy (less bright), etc.

A tree grows up and out. The rings get bigger from 'center out', like dropping a rock in a lake, the rings get bigger. A guitar that has the rings, from back of the body to top, getting LARGER, you get more resonant draw. Its the way the tree grows, a law of nature (physics). The other way (like Eddie's Franky), you get less resonance. The sound will have less headroom and overall bloom. What you WILL get though is a thinner, harder sound with alot of attack (the 'A' end grain seam, like Ed's Franky).

Warmoth ALWAYS uses a two piece body and always use the 'V' join at the end grain seam. This is a sonically prefered ring orientation. Ed's 'VHII studio pic strat with Dano neck' has this prefered endgrain seam.

So, WHY would Ed like a guitar that is slightly thinner,& hard and bright sounding ? I dont know, but assume it was just that (bright, hard attack ). Ash is inherently bright anyways regardless of ring orientation,but there is 'more bloom, less attack' one way and 'less bloom more attack' the other.

The second picture is ( Warmoth) that of a true 'Bookmatched' center seam. It has the 'V' pattern at the seam. The rings get bigger going towards the top/face of the guitar. More headroom and overall 'size' to the sound. The prefered seam.

The third pic (KnE) is converse to the second pic. It is the 'A' pattern at the seam like Ed's Franky. The fundamental sound is thinner and harder/tighter with alot of bite, but lacks the overall headroom and size to the sound. I've ordered/built several guitar bodies with a two piece construction and regardless of the wood species and weight, this is what I have observed, though I didnt initially know why. Musikraft, USA Custom, KnE, Fender, pretty much everybody out there have no ONE WAY. I guess they only consider aesthetics (The side of the two piece blank that looks better ends up as the face of the guitar). This 'ring orientation' thing holds true for one, two, three, etc, piece bodies.

You pluck a string, the mounting screws 'draw' up the vibration/resonance, the bridge plate is engaged, the saddles, the string vibrates according to this and is affected by the direction (orientation) of the rings. The pickup then does its job, but the fundamental resonance precedes the pick up, thats why a electric guitar sounds a certain way regardless of what the pickup adds or subtracts. By comparison, an acoustic guitar is as much about what ISNT there as by what IS. A two piece center seam has two pieces with the rings at an angle when they join right at the most important spots (bridge, neck pocket). You get an increase in 'resonant draw' where it counts the most.

So, regardless of how good Ed made that Franky sound early on, MOST players 'probably' wouldnt have dug that particular guitar, cause it was a overly bright, hard sound that lacked the depth and sonic width that most associate a great guitar as having. And yes, by looking at the guitar you can pretty much tell (but you can definately hear it on the records & Boots). Not dissing it though, my first KnE Azusa (pic 3) does Ed better than my other guitars, but doesnt fare as well doing other sounds...

Where would you say my Northern Ash Musikraft '78 Franky body stands in these different patterns? What grain patterns do you see in it? It appears that it is indeed a two piece center seam through the bridge area, but I'm not sure if it is a "V" or an "A"?

[Rich_D]

I shaded the pic on the bottom right with red to show where the faint grain lines show up through the paint. They are in the exact spot as the unfinished body you posted, it's kind of a wedge shape, one line ends at a 45 degree angle on the side of the jack and the other goes above the jack.

Nailed it. I'm glad you got dragged in.

[Tone Slinger]

Allen, your Musikraft Azusa strat has the 'V' endgrain/join pattern. Its hard to describe how to tell this from top or back shots, but the grain/ring lines curve at a angle as the come off the bodies contour at the horn cut aways on either side of the neck pocket and the butt. In my experience the 'V' join (rings grow bigger towards the top of the body) ALWAYS sounds better than the 'A'. The 'A' endrain/join is opposite, and has the rings going bigger to smaller (outside to inside) as they approach the face of the guitar. This is counter productive in terms of the NATURAL growth of the tree. You tap a tree and the sound is quickly absorbed and then RELEASED (inside (smaller) rings to the outside (larger rings), each ring picks up more and increases the 'resonant draw' as the bridge mounting screws/plate translate this to the saddles and ultimately the string vibrates and the pu does its job, etc. I relate it to throwing a rock in a lake. The rings get bigger and bigger........they DO NOT implode in on themselves.


People assume that Eddie had a Great sounding Amp (12xxx) and a great sounding guitar (Franky). Eddies way of 'USING/TRANSLATING' the sound of his amp, as well as his Franky is what mattered the most (his STYLE). I honestly dont think that Ed's amp nor his guitar were anything special.They sounded 'right' to him and allowed him to fly and we obviously LOVED his flight . It is documented that others (Nuge and Luke) tried his gear and either felt it wasnt special or that it DIDNT sound good to them.

[garbeaj]

Gotcha...thanks Andy! I would have to guess that Scott Smith would know about all this stuff. I wouldn't think that my body was anything out of the ordinary in their production...I would imagine that they are aware of the blanks and the grain patterns. KNE and Warmoth too...

[stef]

I asked Mitch KnE for a W grain orientation and that's what I got. AT the time no one knew for sure whether or not it was the right orientation for the Franky but some members here (vanhalen5150 I think) opted for that one, and that's how I made the choice (W vs V). They used to call it the W, Andy calls it "A"...
I'm of the opinion that grain orientation matters but not that much - body wood choice (species and particular piece of wood) and the neck is what matters the most regarding the tone of the instrument. I could be wrong.

[vanhalen5150]

I always said it was the "w" or "A" as Andy says because of that photo that was around of Franky hanging on 5150 wall. Its from a downward angle and there were a few cords and a note hanging beside it. If you blow up the bottom where the strap screw is you can see the distinct pattern. It will be even more evident now with this new info. Good find fella's. Look for body prices to rise again for the custom "A&W" option.

[rgorke]

I always said it was the "w" or "A" as Andy says because of that photo that was around of Franky hanging on 5150 wall. Its from a downward angle and there were a few cords and a note hanging beside it. If you blow up the bottom where the strap screw is you can see the distinct pattern. It will be even more evident now with this new info. Good find fella's. Look for body prices to rise again for the custom "A&W" option.

You have a very sick mind....a funny one no less!!!

[garbeaj]

I always said it was the "w" or "A" as Andy says because of that photo that was around of Franky hanging on 5150 wall. Its from a downward angle and there were a few cords and a note hanging beside it. If you blow up the bottom where the strap screw is you can see the distinct pattern. It will be even more evident now with this new info. Good find fella's. Look for body prices to rise again for the custom "A&W" option.

Possibly, but as Andy says...theoretically the grain patterns on Ed's Frankenstein may not necessarily be optimum for sustain and tone. Maybe Ed's was after all a "second" as claimed. I suppose for an accurate replica though the "A" pattern in the grain would be the most accurate. I can't imagine that any reputable company like KNE or Musikraft would charge a premium for selecting that pattern. They might charge a premium for selecting any particular grain pattern, but maybe not charging more for an "A" grain pattern versus a "V" grain pattern.

[Tone Slinger]

Gotcha...thanks Andy! I would have to guess that Scott Smith would know about all this stuff. I wouldn't think that my body was anything out of the ordinary in their production...I would imagine that they are aware of the blanks and the grain patterns. KNE and Warmoth too...

See thats the thing Allen........most all of the companies are very 'random' when it comes to a two piece center seam, or an 'off' center seam, etc. I can tell by looking at the showcase and the 'represented' models that Musikraft, for instance, uses ALOT of the 'A' join. KnE uses a 'A' join exclusively from what I've seen and from what I've actually ordered. I had to request a 'V' endgrain join.

I think builders pretty much use the side of the two piece blank that LOOKS best to be the top/face, without ever thinking that one way or the other makes a sonic difference. I finally had that 'Eureka' moment and put my theory to the test. There IS a difference, as I've stated in several previous posts.

Granted, regardless of the 'ring orientation', wood species have distinct differences, mainly in the eq and the resonant 'feel'. Hard Ash is a firmer, brighter tone in general, whereas Alder is a bit softer and not as bright by comparison. Basswood, obviously is at an EXTREME difference, in regards to Ash. Alder is very Balanced and pleases more people overall.

What the ring orientation affects is the overall size and headroom of the resonance. The sustain isnt whats different. Ed was gravitating towards a singular EXTREMITY, in what he was wanting out of guitars sound. He wanted a very hard, biting, bright LASER BEAM of a guitar tone. His Franky ('A' join, or otherwise called 'W') would have been that. You plug that guitar into SRV's rig and it would have been TOO thin and bright(ESPECIALLY had it had single coils). Ed's second (or first ?) Azusa strat (VHII studio pics) was a 'V' join and would have been considered a 'better' sounding guitar by a larger number of folks, whether it had singles or hb'ers.

Warmoth, it seems, uses the 'V' join exclusively. Every now and again you will see a 'A' in the Gallery, but thats probably due to a younger/newer employee who maybe didnt fully 'understand' the training process at first.

KnE likes the 'A' join. Which would lead me to think that he is 'aware' and just likes it better ?

Musikraft is uses either.

And Fender and Gibson are all over the place. Yes this affects ANY guitar.

The layout and instructions for the 'Burst' era Les Pauls ('58-'60) had the exact specs down and used the proper ring orientation (the one piece Mahogany bodies would have had a 'rainbow' grain (backwards 'U') from bottom to top,looking at the guitars butt). Those era Les Pauls sounded good for MORE reasons than just the light weight honduran Mahogany (they had the proper ring orientation
)