Ed's Knob

[spaceace76]

That is a choke. it's the same choke I have in a 1970 Super Lead which is totally stock.

well that puts an end to that speculation
what's it's rating?

[plexified]

Grosh posted the correct choke for his amp .

The correct stock choke for Eds amp was the small U frame .

Clearly that is not the choke Jose chose to use . They do not burn up or short out . It is umbelievably rare to loose a choke .

In the VHII studio pic on the floor it has the very rare huge bell choke . It means it may be an Marshall choke which is very , very rare , or it may be another brand used for a reason .

Its also configured in a way which makes it very easy to resemble several different style chokes and transformers .

It is orientated 90 degrees from stock where the holes for the wires would be as well as to correctly be posiotioned in the layout to address magnetic radiation from the Output transformer as well as power transformer which also have a very clear relationship .

For instance an output transformer for a Fender Deluxe would be that size .

You do not need a choke in your power supply . In fact Marshall used a resistor instead on many designs .

That being said , you can radically alter the character of an amp in this power rail .

[Grosh_Guitars]

The choke is clearly positioned correctly with it's bell ends facing towards either end of the chassis. However yes that choke has been replaced.

[plexified]

The choke is clearly positioned correctly with it's bell ends facing towards either end of the chassis. However yes that choke has been replaced.

Bobby , your right . As a stock 12000 series with the small U frame choke ,that would be the correct orientation .

I'm trying to get folks to think outside the box as usual and I'm sorry for causing confusion .

This amp is always called 'stock' , and its not .

I'm trying to imply with that pictured configuration alot goes out the window . It is simply not what it seems .

The electromagnetics is an issue in the pictured configuration .

And the small 'end bell ' magnetic component ( which can just be a shell ) is what I suggest be pondered .

[Grosh_Guitars]

The choke is clearly positioned correctly with it's bell ends facing towards either end of the chassis. However yes that choke has been replaced.

Bobby , your right . As a stock 12000 series with the small U frame choke ,that would be the correct orientation .

I'm trying to get folks to think outside the box as usual and I'm sorry for causing confusion .

This amp is always called 'stock' , and its not .

I'm trying to imply with that pictured configuration alot goes out the window . It is simply not what it seems .

The electromagnetics is an issue in the pictured configuration .

And the small 'end bell ' magnetic component ( which can just be a shell ) is what I suggest be pondered .

ah, okay I gotcha.

[Ralle]

One thing came to my mind... Look at the pic from EVHII... and then look at the piocs from " Eddie Van halen's guitarsound in the first album " link: http://wwwc.dcns.ne.jp/~epi/english.html.." onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. The pic from EVHII shows a replaced choke and that white knob... But the pics from this link shows the "stock" choke without the white knob... What's up with that?
The stock choke would be in there earlier, at the same time as the knob, right? And the replaced choke would be in there at the same time as without the knob, right? But here's the other way around... I'm lost... Is it the same amp?
Another difference; the backside plexi panel is cracked on topside just by the first preamp tube in the " Eddie Van halen's guitarsound in the first album " pics but not in the EVHII pic... plus that mark after the sticky is not in the same possition as the sticky is placed in the EVHII pic...

[spaceace76]

in this picture: http://wwwc.dcns.ne.jp/~epi/theamplrg.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; it looks like the choke Grosh Guitars posted. I don't doubt that Ed might have brought his amp to different techs for mods over the years. His music changed, as well as his tone, his taste for what sounded good in his rig probably changed a lot too. I'm sure the amp has seen lots of configurations

[Grosh_Guitars]

One thing came to my mind... Look at the pic from EVHII... and then look at the piocs from " Eddie Van halen's guitarsound in the first album " link: http://wwwc.dcns.ne.jp/~epi/english.html.." onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. The pic from EVHII shows a replaced choke and that white knob... But the pics from this link shows the "stock" choke without the white knob... What's up with that?
The stock choke would be in there earlier, at the same time as the knob, right? And the replaced choke would be in there at the same time as without the knob, right? But here's the other way around... I'm lost... Is it the same amp?
Another difference; the backside plexi panel is cracked on topside just by the first preamp tube in the " Eddie Van halen's guitarsound in the first album " pics but not in the EVHII pic... plus that mark after the sticky is not in the same possition as the sticky is placed in the EVHII pic...

That link from that jp site or picture is the more recent picture of his amp right? Like 5 years ago? Didn't they or Ed use it on a recording after they went through it and brought it back to working order? So maybe the new tech installed a better or more period correct choke? or at least one that was better than that one pictured during VHII? Are there any VH1 studio pics floating around of said amp?

[Ralle]

That works for me... I just wondered cause it was said that the u shaped frame was stock, and the other one wasn't... it didn't fit with the time frame, but how knows...

[jp0971]

Plexified,

What's this about the placement of the output transformer? I recall that picture I saw had his amp's OT rotated 90 degrees from how it was originally.....I'll see if I can find it.

[Ralle]

Not if that knob is a pre PI master... I find this very interesting... I've come to the conclution that the 470k mixer is in there somhow... but the coupling cap thing caught my eyes Do you mean that the couplings were placed the other way around; the lead had .022u and the normal had something between .001u and 470pF?
I'm using thet "white knob" to be able to adjust the gain into the seccond stage, and because of that, it fits perfectly to say that the pot was in there for that purpose... but if there's another possibillity of handeling the gain... man this never ends... hard, but great fun

Hey ralle try a .047 and also the PI input put a .047 and get back to me on it I have run in to some killer stuff with your mod brother thank you!!! The pot is just controlling the grid gain correct? My amp I'm getting some clean detailed gain it was HI to much treble until tried the .047 she worked for me, sounds awesome amp to cab as well as lining out from the Rockstah load line box.

Hey. I tryied the .047 u in the PI... and that works VERY well... it might bee something there... more to come

[plexified]

One thing came to my mind... Look at the pic from EVHII... and then look at the piocs from " Eddie Van halen's guitarsound in the first album " link: http://wwwc.dcns.ne.jp/~epi/english.html.." onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. The pic from EVHII shows a replaced choke and that white knob... But the pics from this link shows the "stock" choke without the white knob... What's up with that?
The stock choke would be in there earlier, at the same time as the knob, right? And the replaced choke would be in there at the same time as without the knob, right? But here's the other way around... I'm lost... Is it the same amp?
Another difference; the backside plexi panel is cracked on topside just by the first preamp tube in the " Eddie Van halen's guitarsound in the first album " pics but not in the EVHII pic... plus that mark after the sticky is not in the same possition as the sticky is placed in the EVHII pic...

That link from that jp site or picture is the more recent picture of his amp right? Like 5 years ago? Didn't they or Ed use it on a recording after they went through it and brought it back to working order? So maybe the new tech installed a better or more period correct choke? or at least one that was better than that one pictured during VHII? Are there any VH1 studio pics floating around of said amp?

Bobby , Ed has a huge stockpile of Marshalls as well as other tube amps . He has a massive collection . The amp that was so called restored by the Dutch guy , pictured in the major guitar magazine was not his main amp . Clearly by the statement that he wanted to replate the chassis alone is a dead give away since Eds is raw steel . It was the traditional , " see what you can do with it " approach he usually does with various techs . The cracked panel and such is just more Ed fodder .

The VHII amp pic in the studio is 'the amp '. Jose and all . It has a long progression of work being done .

Don't be surprised with a headbox swap too . After Pan Am lost it for six months , road days were over .

From Rose Palace ~ to Ed blowing it up with experimentation ~ leads to this lineage of tone .

Sad to think Ritchie Fliegler the Spokesperson for Marshall who wrote the article for the Major Guitar Mag was sellin us that story that was downright insulting .

I said it a long time ago . I outed it here then and I stand by it now . Wrong amp .

Back on track to Ed and Jose .

The Drakes were the only available Marshall Transformers .

Huge difference in many ways .

[spaceace76]

Hm, so you're saying all the interest over the 12301 amp is somewhat misguided?
So if it isn't necessarily a 12 series, and it isn't necessarily stock, that means it could be nearly anything.

So are you aware of the progression of work the real main amp went through?

and Drake? interesting...

[leadguy]

I've had a look at the Frequency Spectrum Analysis of 2 slaved ATBL's

http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=29258" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=28381" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

and they are both nowhere near the Frequency Spectrum Analysis of the VH1 ATBL but Dave Friedman's sinasl1 non slaved ATBL is very near the VH1 Frequency Spectrum Analysis.
I think the Dave Friedman Variplex amp is based on a stock 1968 50 watt Plexi.
One slaved ATBL is a cascade of some sort and the other is stock and they are both Superleads I think.

http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=17343" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Some people can say that this is just all garbage but it isn't really.

The only problem with the Dave Friedmans sinasl1 non slaved ATBL Frequency Spectrum Analysis as compared to the VH1 Frequency Spectrum Analysis is in the very low end and very minor differences in the mids and high end.
The slaved ATBL's differ a lot from the VH1 Frequency Spectrum Analysis.

The slaved ATBL's sound good in their own right but their Frequency Spectrum Analysis should be much closer to the VH1 Frequency Spectrum Analysis if Ed slaved and Dave Friedman's sinasl1 non slaved ATBL Frequency Spectrum Analysis is very close to the VH1 Frequency Spectrum Analysis.

Now before all the slaving dudes start, I'm just posting what I've found using Frequency Spectrum Analysis.

IMO the white knob is a mod of some sort but it has to be a minor mod because Ed's Frequency Spectrum Analysis is very near to a stock Plexi and it's not a cascade or a master volume mod IMO.

[plexified]

Hm, so you're saying all the interest over the 12301 amp is somewhat misguided?
So if it isn't necessarily a 12 series, and it isn't necessarily stock, that means it could be nearly anything.

So are you aware of the progression of work the real main amp went through?

and Drake? interesting...

Only Ed and Jose know of the progression , maybe Rudy if he is sharp .

The Rose Palace amp was a raw steel chassis , 12301 would have to be referenced with origionals in series . The Plating came later on and a defining line could be determined .

The article I referenced is from 02/1995 Guitar World page 63 . The amp pictured is not taken specifically for this article , but from a cache of older ones .

Look closely to the far right and see the loose tube shield just hanging out . Not quite a finished restoration . Plust the zip tie on the chord says 'storage' all over it .

Peter Van Wheelden said , quote ;

" take everything off the chassis and replate the zinc ".

"Also one of the origional Drake era plexi transformers had expired "

" Rudy Lieren sent Peter and origional Drake plexi-era to replace the expired one . "

" rewired the entire set with high quality military wire "

Van Whelden later went to launch an amp company .

Food for thought ....