From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 6/13/10 UPDATED!!

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sah5150
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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 1/18/10 UPDATED!!

Post by sah5150 » Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:11 pm

erigm wrote:Steve, this is looking awesome! Very cool project. I think I may use the same relays you are using on your build. 5Vdc yes?
Thanks man - those are actually 6VDC relays...
erigm wrote:I looked at your schematic, and everything looks cool, but I'd be concerned when in the "rod" mode you have the second stage going out through a coupling cap, then a high value resistor to ground, and then straight into a grid resistor bypassed with a cap, and into the third stage. This is putting a lot of gain into that stage. You might even get blocking distortion and the stage might cut out. I would suggest putting some kind of voltage divider in there somewhere. That's just my $.02..
Appreciate your thoughts. The "rod" mode of the schem is based on one of Jose Arredondo's old mods that I have a schem for and I had a couple of amps modded by Jose back in the 80s and liked the way they sounded alot. I believe my amps were the same schem, but there may be an error. Once I get a prototype built, all will be answered! :)
erigm wrote:One more thing ... why did you decide to use relays on the footswitch itself, and not just DPDT footswitches? Just curious.
I don't see how I could do what I'm doing with DPDT footswitches frankly...

Steve

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 1/18/10 UPDATED!!

Post by erigm » Wed Feb 03, 2010 5:12 pm

sah5150 wrote:Appreciate your thoughts. The "rod" mode of the schem is based on one of Jose Arredondo's old mods that I have a schem for and I had a couple of amps modded by Jose back in the 80s and liked the way they sounded alot. I believe my amps were the same schem, but there may be an error. Once I get a prototype built, all will be answered! :)
Ok, no prob. I just know how it is to plan a build and then find out later I missed something relatively simple. If you've tried this scheme with good luck than that is awesome. I can't wait for clips!
erigm wrote:One more thing ... why did you decide to use relays on the footswitch itself, and not just DPDT footswitches? Just curious.
I don't see how I could do what I'm doing with DPDT footswitches frankly...

Steve
I'll have another look at you're schematic. I probably didn't take enough time to figure it out. A cursory glance and I might've not looked deep enough.
erigm

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by sah5150 » Sun Feb 28, 2010 9:50 pm

Haven't done an update in awhile, but I have been working and have a lot of new stuff done. Here is the completed board:

Click for the board image - too large for metro

Also finally finished the heaters. I didn't really have to twist the heaters since it is DC past the power tubes, but it looks nice and is tidy. In the future, I'll re-orient the pre tubes so I can just take wires straight across. Couldn't do it with this preamp tube orientation. Ya live and ya learn, ya know? :D :

Click for the heaters image - too large for metro

Here is the completed output section. You can see the line out and density control wired as well:

Click for the output section image - too large for metro

I've done a bit of the on/off wiring as well. Next is to finish that, put in the 6V tranny and the little board to power the relays and then install the board and finish wiring it up!

Steve

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by erigm » Sun Feb 28, 2010 11:36 pm

This is exciting. I can't wait to hear how this thing turns out! Don't do like I do and start rushing when you get close to the end. :lol: :oops: :wink:
erigm

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by Doug H » Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:36 am

man, haven't you finished that puppy yet?!?

:D

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by sah5150 » Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:19 am

erigm wrote:This is exciting. I can't wait to hear how this thing turns out! Don't do like I do and start rushing when you get close to the end. :lol: :oops: :wink:
I know what you mean - I wanna start rushing too, but I'm doing my best to be methodical and check everything multiple times...

Steve

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by sah5150 » Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:20 am

Doug H wrote:man, haven't you finished that puppy yet?!?

:D
Geez man, I only started ywo years ago. :lol:

Steve

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by Tone Junkie » Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:19 pm

Steve Im kind of a newbie but I really like the look of everything you have so far. What Im really interested in learning about is your DC preamp heaters setup could you give us more on that a better picture i dont read schematics well Im learning but a look at the placement of your board thats all wired up would do me worlds of good . Then I could compare to your schematic drawing and understand it better. Its the only way i really understand things. I read alot but havnt ran across this in a way I can understand yet. Sorry for the newb question. Thanks Bill

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by sah5150 » Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:37 pm

Tone Junkie wrote:Steve Im kind of a newbie but I really like the look of everything you have so far. What Im really interested in learning about is your DC preamp heaters setup could you give us more on that a better picture i dont read schematics well Im learning but a look at the placement of your board thats all wired up would do me worlds of good . Then I could compare to your schematic drawing and understand it better. Its the only way i really understand things. I read alot but havnt ran across this in a way I can understand yet. Sorry for the newb question. Thanks Bill
Bill,

Thanks!

In regards to your DC heater related question, just compare these schematics:

Preamp Schematic
Effects Loop Schematic
Power Section Schematic
Foot Switch Schematic

to this fully wired layout:

Final Layout

These schematic and the layout should make things clear. The layout is much easier to read than any picture of the amp would be... The layouts and final schematics are scattered thought this thread, but I copied the links here for you... PM if you have questions...

Steve

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by erigm » Fri Mar 05, 2010 12:03 am

Steve,

What do you use to draw these layouts? I use Illustrator, and am pretty happy with that, but yours look fantastic!
erigm

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by sah5150 » Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:38 am

erigm wrote:Steve,

What do you use to draw these layouts? I use Illustrator, and am pretty happy with that, but yours look fantastic!
I'm using TurboCAD. I wanted to build really accurate models and CAD is the best way to go. Steep learning curve, but I got a lot of help.

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by Tone Junkie » Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:31 am

Thanks Steve that really helps having them all on the same page . The only reason I can remotly understand anything on a schematic is guys like you putting out these great layouts. So I can compare them to . A different question can I pick your brain for a second . The reason your chosing this type of amp and layout if you dont mind me asking. (Sorry for the newbie questions)its a plexi rod and I see a zen switch or master what type of sound do all those differant things give you . I know what the plexi is obviously but what are the other circuits and sounds your trying to achieve. I told you they were dumb newbie questions. And I also understand if you dont have time to answer such things right know. Im currently in the process of building a 50watt 1987 circuit with an extra gain stage and my hope is to understand good switching and dc heaters by my next build. this stuff is addicting . Thank you Bill :D

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 2/28/10 UPDATED!!

Post by sah5150 » Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:15 am

Tone Junkie wrote:Thanks Steve that really helps having them all on the same page . The only reason I can remotly understand anything on a schematic is guys like you putting out these great layouts. So I can compare them to . A different question can I pick your brain for a second . The reason your chosing this type of amp and layout if you dont mind me asking. (Sorry for the newbie questions)its a plexi rod and I see a zen switch or master what type of sound do all those differant things give you . I know what the plexi is obviously but what are the other circuits and sounds your trying to achieve. I told you they were dumb newbie questions. And I also understand if you dont have time to answer such things right know. Im currently in the process of building a 50watt 1987 circuit with an extra gain stage and my hope is to understand good switching and dc heaters by my next build. this stuff is addicting . Thank you Bill :D
Bill,

No problem answering some questions!

I chose to build this amp because I wanted a few different sounds, footswitchable, in one amp. I love the old Super Leads and I wanted to have that sound, fully cranked and I wanted to be able to bring the volume down, which is the reason for the post phase inverter master volume (PPIMV) on the back. I also owned a few Jose Arredondo modded Marshalls in the '80s that I gigged with and I loved the sound I got from those amps. I wanted to reproduce that tone and the schematic that is floating around for that amp is (I believe) accurate to the mods I had in my amps. I only needed to reproduce the lead channel of that amp because that is all I ever used. It is basically like a hot rodded 800 - more gain, more aggressive. The zen switch simply switches in a Jose Mater volume in place of the normal 800 master (and Super Lead "master"). The Jose master uses zener diodes (hence "Zen Master" :D ) for clipping - kinda like a built in boost. So in my amp, you can adjust the volume of each mode to match each other for live use (or use the Zen mode for a solo boost) and you can foot switch in any of the modes as well as the effects loop. You can control the overall volume of all channels with the PPIMV if you need to - I think I'd only use it for Plex mode with the master and gain cranked to mimic a Super Lead at lower volume really. You can also switch between parallel and series modes for the effects loop, although you can't do that from the foot switch. I mainly added the loop for others that use them. I'll never use the loop because I run W/D/W. That is why I have an adjustable line out in my amp. I send the line out to my stereo effects processor, then out to a stereo power amp and then a stereo 4x12 for the effects. I run the dry signal straight from the speaker out of my amp. The rest of the stuff is pretty standard. To be honest, if I as building this amp for myself, I could have simplified it A LOT by not have the effects loop, which adds a lot of components to the board and a lot of general complexity. Other folks rely on them though and I wanted them to have a flexible one... I wanted a tube buffered loop as well...

Good luck with your build!

Hope that helps,

Steve

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 3/7/10 UPDATED!!

Post by sah5150 » Sun Mar 07, 2010 8:22 pm

Ok, more progress today. I finished (what I could without the board in for good anyway) the on/off/standby stuff. Then, I installed my board and cut the wires that come from the board to the correct size so it can be wired in. I labeled all the wires that are attached under the board so I would know where they go. I need to wire the preamp filter cap under the board and I need to wire in a new ground wire for the loop because I cut it too short thinking it was another wire - no big deal. The choke, last OT wire and one more power TX wire need to be cut and soldered as well. That stuff needs to happen when the board is in for good...

I also soldered in the ground bus wire on the pots just like my layout drawing. Bent the lugs up and twisted them to get some 18 gauge bus wire through. The colorful bundle of wires with the twist ties go to the foot switch and the long red wire from the last relay DIN goes to the relay power supply board. Before I can wire in the board and start testing this, I need to create and build a new small relay power board (the one I built originally won't work with one of the components I'm using) and drill the chassis for the board and 6V AC power transformer and wire that stuff in. Once that is done, it is a matter of wiring the board and the loop components in and it'll be test time. Maybe a few more weeks until I fire it up for the first time. Oh yeah... I, of course, still need to build the foot switch which is no small task... Here are the pictures:

Click for the progress image 1 - too large for metro
Click for the progress image 2 - too large for metro
Click for the progress image 3 - too large for metro
Click for the progress image 4 - too large for metro

Steve

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Re: From Scratch Amp Building Chronicle - 3/7/10 UPDATED!!

Post by syscokid » Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:30 pm

sah5150 wrote: Click for the progress image 4 - too large for metro
Steve
Image
That's intimidating.... :shock:

Can't wait till it's done... 8)
"When I'm on stage and first plug in, and I feel a rush of air in my balls... That's when I know my guitar is sounding good!" -Leslie West

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