Winding Your own Pickups

mightymike · Post by **mightymike** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 8:53 am

I don't know if this one is any good. But I'd sure like to play with one of these days.
http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/I-1465.html

I think it would be fun discovering different wind techniques, just like
different amp circuits. And then Matching them up with my different amps.

Necrovore · Post by **Necrovore** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 9:39 am

mightymike wrote:I don't know if this one is any good. But I'd sure like to play with one of these days.
http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/I-1465.html

I think it would be fun discovering different wind techniques, just like
different amp circuits. And then Matching them up with my different amps.

That actually looks pretty darn cool. Would be interesting to look into one of those in the future. If you read the instruction sheet for one of the pickup kits they sell, it is a bit vague on how the windings are connected on a humbucker. That or at this point in the day Im not fully awake to comprehend how they are describing it.

BashCoder · Post by **BashCoder** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 12:25 pm

Where can you get the kind of hand-winding tools that a lot of the boutique pickup winders use? And where do they get their magnets, pole pieces, etc? Stewart-MacDonald sells pickup kits, but I wonder if there is another wholesale source that sells just the parts in bulk?

Necrovore · Post by **Necrovore** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:11 pm

BashCoder wrote:Where can you get the kind of hand-winding tools that a lot of the boutique pickup winders use? And where do they get their magnets, pole pieces, etc? Stewart-MacDonald sells pickup kits, but I wonder if there is another wholesale source that sells just the parts in bulk?

That is exactly what I am wondering. I don't like the pole/stud pieces that Stewmac sells. I would want either all hex type screws like Dimarzio uses, and also the opportunity to even possibly use blade type bobbins.

ampSnob · Post by **ampSnob** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 5:48 am

I was thinking about trying this too. Their kit comes with an alnico 5 magnet and I'd like an alnico 2. Anyone know of a source for these? Anyone have any they'd like to sell?

Some time ago I did some research and cobbled together from various boards and such the following recipe for a PAF clone:

Alnico 2 magnet - 42 gauge wire - scatter wound loosely (not precisicion and tight like you would get from a fancy high tech modern machine -- think gibson employee not paying much attention with barely any useful tools in the 50s) --unbalanced coils (the screw side wound hotter than the slug - by just how much I don't know - high order pickups have this down but it's a secret recipe) total resistance 8.5ish k-ohm (this is approximately 4550 turns) for the bridge and 7.9ish kohm (appx 4500 turns) for the bridge (hence the model numbers of the tom holmes 455 and 450 pickups) -- Screw pieces and mounting bracket are nickel plated. Don't know about the slugs or the spacer. Anyone got any more tips/info/corrections?

As for assembly, I was going to go with a super high tech approach of placing the bobbin on a turntable and rigging some sort of wire feeder. This half assed approach should also help the scatterwinding and desired loose tensionand approximate the number of turns by calculating time. [4550/33.3rpm = 136.636 total min = 2.277 hours] per coil

BTW: This board has some good info too last time I looked:
http://music-electronics-forum.com/foru ... y.php?f=11

edit: fixed the tom holmes model numbers and redid the math

BashCoder · Post by **BashCoder** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 10:17 am

Cool - thanks for that info! We're going to figure this out, fellas. Let's blow the doors off the DIY pickup scene.

novosibir · Post by **novosibir** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 11:23 am

And when is anybody designing a pickup with a buildt in tube preamp?

Larry

mightymike · Post by **mightymike** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 12:34 pm

I'll be checking out those forums. Thanks for the link.
The Stewart McDonald site mentioned other pickup winding sites that have info.

I would like to see other pickup winding machines and learn more about what kind is the "the" kind to get. Is that Stweart Mcdonald one not as good as others? I'm all ears. What should I get? It would interesting to see what Jeff at High Order Uses., or Jim at WCR uses. Both of them are very good.

If I get one, I'll try everything I can, but where I'll start is with A2 Asymetrical Winds in the 8.5 to 9.2k range, and A2 and A5 Strat and P90 experiments to create pickups dialed in specificly for the amps I build. I think it would an ear opening experience to create your own custom wound pickups, dialed in just the way you like it, played through a guitar and amp that you built yourself. It would give you much more control of your tone, and probably a better understanding of it. I admire those that already know all these art forms to a high degree like Suhr, and Leo Fender did RIP.

On a side note:

I heard that Van Zandt casts their own magnets, and that their single coil strat pickups share some kind of similiarity in their construction to a P90.
Don't ask me how, I have no idea. Ever since I was told this, I've been drooling for some Vanzandts. They just arrived. That P90 part of the story has me taking a 2nd look at those Seymour Duncan Quarter Pounders. If I got a pickup winder, I would be experimenting with p90/strat hybrids. Supposedly these Vanzandt were what SRV used.

JD · Post by JD » Sun Dec 03, 2006 1:24 pm

There are guys out there who are doing custom pickups, do some "googling" on bobbins and magnets. It is possible to make up a mounting jig and wind pickups on a drill press. Back in the day, Gibson wound them (by hand) "until the bobbins were full". What I would do is just wind them full and then peel off enough winds until they are at the DC resistance you want. Stewmac.com (free info) and Lindy Fralin have some good info on pickup winding.

The Gibson '57 Classics have closely matched bobbins, within like 20 ohms (ie 4.05K + 4.03K = 8.08K overall). The BurstBuckers have the mismatched coils, but just barely. I have repaired and measured quite a few original Gibson pickups and the BurstBuckers have a very subtle mismatch, like only a couple hundred ohms (ie 4.21K + 4.02K = 8.23K overall). Most people agree the '57 Classics have a bit smoother tone whereas the BurstBuckers slight coil mismatch gives them a bit more harmonics and sound a bit more raw overdriven.

Gibson (and most aftermarket companies) now wax pots stock pickups to reduce microphonics and also sells pickups aftermarket unpotted to give a closer replica of the originals (however the originals had laquer on the bobbins I believe). Winding pattern and tension plays a part, as does wire coating, magnet gauss, etc.

ampSnob · Post by **ampSnob** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 3:46 am

OOPS I got the holmes info wrong in the above post. I'll go back and fix it. The model numbers are H450 (neck) and H455 (bridge) which means the winds should be 4500 and 4550. Sorry about that. To make up here are some measurements fresh from the multimeter with the pickups not hooked up to any other circuit (out of the guitar):

tom holmes 455
(red white): 4.12k
(green black): 4.11k
total: 8.23k

tom holmes 450
(red white): 3.71k
(green black): 3.6k
total: 7.31k

high order bridge
coil one (red green): 4.15k
coil two: (balck white) 4.06k
total: 8.21k

high order neck
coil one: (red green) 3.77k
coil two: (black white): 3.78k (interesting I thought they'd be unbalanced)
total: 7.55k

burst bucker 2 (alnico 2?)
total: 7.95

burst bucker 3 (alnico 2?)
total: 8.32

Duncan Custom shop Evenly Voiced Harmonics pickup (in a guitar and wired up - coil tapped. A2):
(black white) 4.48k
(green white) 4.44k
total.8.92k

Plexi palace Kent Armstrong Custom wound (some sort of alnico):
(green black) 4.5k
(red white) 4.53k
total: 9.03

--Note that all sorts of factors can effect that resistance reading most noteably wire guage and temperature. On different days you will get different reading from any given pickup. but since these designed are fairly similar and I measured them at the same time (58 degrees F in my garage) this comparison should be somewhat useful.

mightymike · Post by **mightymike** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 5:31 am

So which of these was your favorite overall, and which one did you find gets the best VH tone?

NY Chief · Post by **NY Chief** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:42 pm

Stooopid question...when mounting a humbucker does it really matter which side faces the neck (screws vs blank) other then where the wire exits?

novosibir · Post by **novosibir** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 1:33 pm

It matters, because through the screws the PU's magnetic field is closer to the strings. Unless you have the screws lower than the cover's surface.

Larry

ampSnob · Post by **ampSnob** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 1:06 am

I like the holmes best. When I put it in it was just like wow -gonna stop there - that's the sound. pricey, but it's got the mojo.

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