favorite eruption phrase (i know this is SICK)

Strat78 · Post by **Strat78** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 12:15 am

Tone Slinger wrote:Here's a little story invoving that lick.

It's '89, I'm at a Paul Gilbert clinic. Paul is ,technically , tearing it up, playing all kinds of 'scary' stuff. We get to the request part, where people ask questions, which more often than not, is like this, "Can you play this Malmsteen solo", or Have you heard of Akira Takasaki" (Paul had, and even said he ripped alot of licks from the guy). Paul finally looked my way , and I ask him to play 'Eruption'. I hear alot of murmers and sounds of disbelief that I had asked Paul,who had just run the gamut in the latest of sweeped arppegios and string skipping licks, to play this solo that everyone 'THOUGHT' they could play.

You know what Paul did ? He only played the fuckin' tapping part, albeit with his left hand over the top of the neck. I was bummed, because that fast,boingy assed lick,to me, was and still is one of the most awesome licks EVER.I guess, I was more into 'feel' than the vast majority of those shredder dudes there.

It's kind of cool these days because more people seem to cringe when they hear sweeps and that machine like picking technique. There is hope!

sadwings75 · Post by **sadwings75** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 12:58 am

Nice story toneslinger; I know that Paul's a big fan of Eddie's and holds him in high regard. Paul has always been a great technical player but as he's gotten older, it's my opinion that he's gotten more into feeling, while still playing fast of course. I think he himself has moved away from sweep picking as well.

rgalpin · Post by **rgalpin** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:23 pm

a couple people asked me about this - so here's what i'm doing. it works for me. i like staying in the standard blues position so that this, or parts of it, are more easily worked in with other licks that i might play when improvising or whatnot...

let's see if i can do this... without a guitar in my hands... G B E strings only here...

----------------16-17-20-----------17-20-17-20-17----------------------
----16-18-20---------------17-20-------------------19-20-19-17--------
-18----------------------18------------------------------------------------

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--18-17-18-17[bend up]-18-[bend down]17------17[wammy twice]--
--------------------------------------------------------19-------------------

somebody tab it the other way so i can see how you do it...

i'm interested in which notes are picked and which are hammered/pulled/slide - i'm not hearing it myself.

Bronco · Post by **Bronco** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:50 pm

----------------16-17-20---------------14-17-20-17-20-17-14-15-14---
----16-18-20-------------(14)-17-20--------------------------------------
-18--------------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--17-14-----14------------------------------------------------------------
----------17----17[bend up]-14-17[wammy twice]--14------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bad habit I guess, but I don't use my pinky for the strech; the 14-17-20 is the index, middle, and ring finger. I guess it really doesn't matter...plus, the bend on the G string (17th fret) right before the whammy lick at the end is set up pretty easy that way (for me).

rgalpin · Post by **rgalpin** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 4:03 pm

Bronco wrote:----------------16-17-20---------------14-17-20-17-20-17-14-15-14---
----16-18-20-------------(14)-17-20--------------------------------------
-18--------------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--17-14-----14------------------------------------------------------------
----------17----17[bend up]-14-17[wammy twice]--14------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bad habit I guess, but I don't use my pinky for the strech; the 14-17-20 is the index, middle, and ring finger. I guess it really doesn't matter...plus, the bend on the G string (17th fret) right before the whammy lick at the end is set up pretty easy that way (for me).

oh!! cool. i thought the 14th fret technique would leave you doing that C# C stuff entirely on the B string which seemed bizarre to me - but the way you have it here makes a lot of sense.

ericopp · Post by **ericopp** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 4:04 pm

I don't remember learning those particular passing tones when I studied jazz/bebop music theory.

Reminds me of Ed's dad comparing his playing to "like Charlie Parker, only without the drugs..."

Bronco · Post by **Bronco** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 4:17 pm

ericopp wrote:Reminds me of Ed's dad comparing his playing to "like Charlie Parker, only without the drugs..."

Bronco · Post by **Bronco** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 4:28 pm

rgalpin wrote:oh!! cool. i thought the 14th fret technique would leave you doing that C# C stuff entirely on the B string which seemed bizarre to me - but the way you have it here makes a lot of sense.

Rob, as you have it nailed the way you're playing it, I think it's really cool you're interested in seeing how others approach the same thing...incidentally, pretty much every tab of this lick I've ever seen is they way I play it - this is strictly because I just have always had a tough time figuring out things just by ear, even when I slow it down to half speed.

This is the only reason I play it the way I do...if your phrasing had been in the tabs, I'd undoubtedly be playing it that way (or rather, probably not played it all - it'd be too tough for me

)

The way I posted may or (in all likelihood) may not be "correct", but given my influences (DeMartini in particular), it makes sense for me to approach it this way. It just ends up feeling very elastic and "snappy" - kind of a muscle memory thing.

Plus, it's always been easier for me to play 3 note runs per string than 2, which IMHO takes far more attention to detail and technique. 3 notes per string = more time for your index finger to transfer to the next string, while hammering on two notes (yeah, I'm not the greatest picker either.)

rgalpin · Post by **rgalpin** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 5:09 pm

ericopp wrote:I don't remember learning those particular passing tones when I studied jazz/bebop music theory.

the dude had a vision and he believed in it and brought it to life. amazing when you think about it. imagine what it took to sit there on the edge of the bed playing licks like that and following ideas and inspirations to the point where you create a whole new era of guitar playing. he was able to go somewhere no one else had gone yet. that takes so much creativity and belief in yourself - he took the things that inspired him and rebulit them into his own thing and 30 years later we're clammering around saying "wut he do?"

Strat78 · Post by **Strat78** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 5:23 pm

Bronco wrote: Bad habit I guess, but I don't use my pinky for the strech; the 14-17-20 is the index, middle, and ring finger. I guess it really doesn't matter...plus, the bend on the G string (17th fret) right before the whammy lick at the end is set up pretty easy that way (for me).

I've been going back and forth on this for the last month. The stretch is not that hard to do without the pinkie and it sounds a little more assertive just using the first three fingers. For me the execution is a little cleaner as well when the pinkie is not used but it is such a great way to keep the pinky in shape. I'm torn on this still.

Strat78 · Post by **Strat78** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:32 pm

Rob, I'm the one who is sick here

See attached PDF file.
Here is how I believe this riff was played. It seems that Ed had pattern #1 in mind but in the blur of things he miss hit the 18 instead of 17 on the B string and the picked but missed note on 14 E string, but these are very happy mistakes that make the original Eruption very mysterious and abstract. It's true that we never heard Ed play this exact riff again but he does play within the bounds of riff #1 all the time.

I've played it like #3 for years but the accents never seem to materialize correctly, kind of like playing the Ice cream Man riff incorrectly on one string. So with #2, the riff is a little bumpier sounding and rhythmically interesting verses the clean fluidity of #3 and Ed does these kinds of hammer ons all the time. Something happens between the 15--14 notes that is more than just a half step pulloff, so it's got to be the 20 on the B string instead of the 15 on the E string. On a side note, I've been leaving out that X(14) part, but I'm going to try and work it in for accuracy.

The key to making the riff work is using the middle finger and pinkie (or ring finger) to do that little trill on the 17---20---17---20 part. It seems to be the only way to be set up for pulling off to the 14 on the E string.

The hardest part of this riff for me is that first 16--18--20 run on the B string. Is it all picked or just the first and second or first and third? With a little more study I think we could figure it out. I included where I think it should be picked and what fingers to use. It would be cool if we could further nail this thing down. Any thoughts?

It's the part after this riff that I just adore. That trem work is just brilliant the way it transitions to the "Jack Benny" part!

tonepilgrim · Post by **tonepilgrim** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 7:18 pm

Strat - you are a very sick man.

And this is very cool analysis. Seems plausible to me.

rgalpin · Post by **rgalpin** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:28 am

Strat78 - very cool. I've never really used that spread there that kind of bridges the major pentatonic to the minor pentatonic but I can see that there is a lot of fertile ground there to be had. Thanks for the insight.

The C C# piece seems to sound more right the way you have it there in #2 and #3. Feels good too.

I think that the 3 note patterns on one string seem to have the EVH swing to them when you pick the first note DOWNSTROKE, second note HAMMER, third note pick UPSTROKE. That way your picking hand can just swing:
duh---- ga duh --- ga duh
DOWN up DOWN up DOWN

45auto · Post by **45auto** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:36 am

your's sounded better Rob!(alot better)

Strat78 · Post by **Strat78** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 12:30 pm

rgalpin wrote:Strat78 - very cool. I've never really used that spread there that kind of bridges the major pentatonic to the minor pentatonic but I can see that there is a lot of fertile ground there to be had. Thanks for the insight.

The C C# piece seems to sound more right the way you have it there in #2 and #3. Feels good too.

I think that the 3 note patterns on one string seem to have the EVH swing to them when you pick the first note DOWNSTROKE, second note HAMMER, third note pick UPSTROKE. That way your picking hand can just swing:
duh---- ga duh --- ga duh
DOWN up DOWN up DOWN

I've been picking it that way too and it sounds great however that first run:

|----------------16--17--20-|
|---16--18--20--------------|
|--18-------------------------|
-sounds like every note is picked except the last 20 on the E string. This is killing me yet I can't stop trying! How the hell does he pick each note and swing it at the same time at that speed! That run is easy to do with legato but that's taking the easy way out. I can swear I'm hearing a pick sound for the
18--20 which throws a wrench into everything.

Rob, that recording you posted was great, could you post all of eruption at that very slow speed. Everything was very clear and easy to discern. Do you hear those picked notes?