Super Lead Tweaks - Unchained

[MrBeasty]

Shared-Cathode is less gainy than Split-Cathode. So while you still get a pretty good distortion with the amp dimmed, there is less compression coming from the Pre-amp. Unless Rob is seriously boosting his signal upfront, it should be expected to have less sustain.
I used to run a 820/330 share-cathode and it was hard to get the right amount of gain, even dimmed. Split-cathode is more rewarding.

I must have missed that it was a shared.

Huh?! What you talkin' aboot?

[rgorke]

Shared-Cathode is less gainy than Split-Cathode. So while you still get a pretty good distortion with the amp dimmed, there is less compression coming from the Pre-amp. Unless Rob is seriously boosting his signal upfront, it should be expected to have less sustain.
I used to run a 820/330 share-cathode and it was hard to get the right amount of gain, even dimmed. Split-cathode is more rewarding.

I must have missed that it was a shared.

Huh?! What you talkin' aboot?

I thought you were saying Rob's is shared versus split? No? Maybe I shouldn't read stuff on the Metro.

[rgalpin]

Yes, it is shared. And one thing I haven't tried yet is to seriously boost the front with a GE10 to see how it reacts. Metro... yee ha!

[rgalpin]

I'm experimenting with running the cab in parallel with the attenuator - it seems to take A LOT of the high end out - is that expected or just me?

it sounds great in the room but then listening to a recording it's amazing how the highs are GONE! too much gone - i have to actually add 4K type stuff on the recording to get in the same general EQ world as the albums.

anyone else experience when running in parallel? wondering if i'm doing it wrong somehow - or just going deaf etc...

[awangotango]

the loads tend to do that a touch ime, but if it's very apparent or over the top, i'd say it's the nature of the load itself or something's whacked elsewhere. As i mentioned, different types sound different. My fav does not chop off the upper end in any real way. I feel I have 95% of the tone I get without a parallel load........ if you've ever compared ply vs particle board backed cabs and noticed that slight change, that is the best approximation of the parallel load's affect on things vs no load. it's a subtle compression and light taming of the highs. It shouldn't be anything dramatic or causing after-the-fact e/q fixes. So, if it's not your load, the only other idea is that something is wrong elsewhere. you measure all the loads to be right? amp is not dialed in far from stock? etc. what's the speaker arrangement? are they greenbacks and getting max watts? If so, it may be what your webers sound like when they are pushed. real greenbacks darken quite a bit when they are maxed as well, but in a pleasing way. A marshall should still have plenty of sparkle though unless something's out of whack.

[rgalpin]

Great info. Thanks!

Maybe the MASS 150 is not showing 8 ohms after all.

I had the same dramatic drop in high end with the V30s as I am getting with the Webers. It wasn't as noticeable at first b/c the V30s aren't as warm to begin with.

With 2 EH6CA7's and variacing down to 350 to 400 plate voltage, I should be able to run straight into the 2x12 w/ no parallel load and see how it acts.

I'll try that - just to confirm.

How much do you think having the 2 disconnected speakers hanging around in there is affecting things?

Would you mount them diagonally? (upper right and lower left) right now they are both in the top holes.

How would you cover/seal the holes when taking out the 2 disconnected spkrs?

[awangotango]

i mount mine on top but i've done diagonal too with good results. if you leave the others unwired, the two sitting in there will act like passive radiators. Like in a home stereo, some speakers have passive drivers just sitting there which helps with low end extension I believe. Which is not something we want, so I'd guess they will have a negative influence. Yank em and ply over the holes is what i do/suggest (1/4" ply screwed from the inside) It sounds great.....you sure like taking the long way home. why are the v30's still in the picture?

[rgalpin]

i just got the webers out of my other cab (easier than transporting the cab) on wednesday night - i put them in - but i made clips with the v30s first which is cool cause now i have a reference to learn from.

i think i just found that my problem with the high end is in PT - working it out... i THOUGHT it sounded like plenty of high end in the room - but the recordings never lie right??? not this time...

[rgalpin]

Clip:
http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=11708520" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Webers 2x12, lowered the preamp to 16+16, adjusted variac to 390V at plates, bias to 75%.

Not as sexy as a secret pedal but this is guitar>eppre>amp>speakers and no post EQ.

Here is how it campares in an A/B to the album: (not saying it's close or not - just saying if we are going to compare, then let's do it!)

PS - lost my tennis racket

[Thorny]

Sounds off the hook man. Rob one thing that throws off the iso's is the fact that they are mono and the reverb and the dry side are mixed together if you downloaded them off youtube. Are you using the actual album tracks or the iso tracks from youtube?

[rgalpin]

Sounds off the hook man. Rob one thing that throws off the iso's is the fact that they are mono and the reverb and the dry side are mixed together if you downloaded them off youtube. Are you using the actual album tracks or the iso tracks from youtube?

I'm using the left side of the album and panning it 75% left to immitate the placement in the stereo field.

[MrBeasty]

I'm experimenting with running the cab in parallel with the attenuator - it seems to take A LOT of the high end out - is that expected or just me?

it sounds great in the room but then listening to a recording it's amazing how the highs are GONE! too much gone - i have to actually add 4K type stuff on the recording to get in the same general EQ world as the albums.

anyone else experience when running in parallel? wondering if i'm doing it wrong somehow - or just going deaf etc...

It might be a psycho-acoustic effect. We do not hear things the same way based on loudness.

Clip:
http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=11708520" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Webers 2x12, lowered the preamp to 16+16, adjusted variac to 390V at plates, bias to 75%.

Not as sexy as a secret pedal but this is guitar>eppre>amp>speakers and no post EQ.

Here is how it campares in an A/B to the album: (not saying it's close or not - just saying if we are going to compare, then let's do it!)

PS - lost my tennis racket

Sound very good, there are differences but they are more likely tied to production issues (mic-ing, tape vs. digital, 30 year recording vs. modern, etc). Kudos!

[rgalpin]

I'm experimenting with running the cab in parallel with the attenuator - it seems to take A LOT of the high end out - is that expected or just me?

it sounds great in the room but then listening to a recording it's amazing how the highs are GONE! too much gone - i have to actually add 4K type stuff on the recording to get in the same general EQ world as the albums.

anyone else experience when running in parallel? wondering if i'm doing it wrong somehow - or just going deaf etc...

It might be a psycho-acoustic effect. We do not hear things the same way based on loudness.

It turned out to be a ProTools thing - once I got to a certain limit of tracks like i had 30 tracks of different specs - it downgraded the quality of the tracks to save cpu overhead. I made a new project and the mystery was solved (no secret pedal was involved - fyi)!

the unintended outcome was i realized i didn't need the parallel load anyway - the amp is just not all that loud as a 50W variac'd to 90V.

[awangotango]

wonder why you lost your tennis racket ? maybe it's because you took out 1/4 of the amp's voltage. we all know a sl fed 90v will never sound or feel like one getting 120. unless you prefer 90, the load is the better way to get real sl at that same volume where's you're at now or less.

[sine_wave]

That clip sounds amazing!
To me, the clips with your original filter-specs sound best. Since your preamp is 16+16 I assume you're getting 32. That is how you've got it connected, right? On that last clip, do you have your screens at 25uf, Mains at 50uf and PI at 50uf?

- John

Clip:
http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=11708520" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Webers 2x12, lowered the preamp to 16+16, adjusted variac to 390V at plates, bias to 75%.

Not as sexy as a secret pedal but this is guitar>eppre>amp>speakers and no post EQ.

Here is how it campares in an A/B to the album: (not saying it's close or not - just saying if we are going to compare, then let's do it!)

PS - lost my tennis racket