Metropoulos Forum

Hey Guys

Can anyone explain how blackbacks sound compared to greenbacks? Thanks.

OK

Search is your friend, I know, I know. Just takes more time. From what I have read, most of the blackbacks have sp444 cones which are basically the same as Vintage 30's so the sound compared to Greens is a bit bright, harsh and louder perhaps a bit mid scooped. If anyone disagrees please let me know. If not, I consider my search results valid. Thanks.

My blackbacks sound very similar to my heritage greenbacks.

ttowne wrote:OK

Search is your friend, I know, I know. Just takes more time. From what I have read, most of the blackbacks have sp444 cones which are basically the same as Vintage 30's so the sound compared to Greens is a bit bright, harsh and louder perhaps a bit mid scooped. If anyone disagrees please let me know. If not, I consider my search results valid. Thanks.

Yup, the story is much more complicated than that so research is needed!
late 60's Greenbacks 75Hz speakers used 102 003 cones
late 60's Greenbacks 55Hz speakers used 102 014 cones
mid 70's Blackbacks 75Hz used 1777cones
mid 70's Blackbacks 55Hz used 444 cones
later Greenbacks carried on with the 1777 and 444 cones, although Heritages used their own cones

there are lots of variants like the more modern 6402 Greenback RIs that are quite liked.

Perhaps Jim could do a sticky?

neikeel wrote: there are lots of variants like the more modern 6402 Greenback RIs that are quite liked.

Thanks Neil, the 6402 cone has puzzled me, I've see it mentioned a few times in the evh section... but I'm struggling to get a link to evh with it being a later reissue I would of thought he'd use 1777 or even 003's?

jape88 wrote:

neikeel wrote: there are lots of variants like the more modern 6402 Greenback RIs that are quite liked.

Thanks Neil, the 6402 cone has puzzled me, I've see it mentioned a few times in the evh section... but I'm struggling to get a link to evh with it being a later reissue I would of thought he'd use 444 or even 003's?

I hope someone will correct me if I am wrong but I think that a 6402 is somewhere between a 003 and a 1777 ie a lead cone usually seen on 90's Greenback M speakers. I have never had/knowingly heard any so cannot comment myself.

The 6402 cone was Celestion's attempt to recreate the 102 003 Pulsonic cone. They didn't quite measure up, but they're a decent sounding cone, better than the 1777 G12M RI's.

They were made from the late 80's to the mid 90's (latest date code I saw put them around 96/97), but they are no longer being made.

Some say they switched that cone to being called the 53H1777 cone later on, but having compared them side by side, I don't fine the 53H1777 cone to be as good as the 6402 cone.

EVH probably wouldn't have used them based on when he recorded vs when they were made.

Thanks for clearing that one Jim, my moneys on 003's for Ed with recording.

I'll think I'll stick with 003's as I've been looking for 6402 to try out so you've saved me some money

jape88 wrote:Thanks for clearing that one Jim, my moneys on 003's for Ed with recording.

I'll think I'll stick with 003's as I've been looking for 6402 to try out so you've saved me some money

I'm hoping you already have the 102 003 cones since they're rarer than the 6402 cones.

My mid-70s blackback G12H/55hz speakers all have 444 cones? What gives?

Mr. Mullard wrote:My mid-70s blackback G12H/55hz speakers all have 444 cones? What gives?

The 444 cone has been the standard 55hz cone since 1974 (post pre rola, and R/Cxxx cones).

The 1777 cone has been the standard 75hz cone since 74 as well.

What did you think they were supposed to have?

It goes contrary to what someone posted above....

Mr. Mullard wrote:It goes contrary to what someone posted above....

Oh, just saw neikeel's post....uh...buddy, love you but you've got your cones reversed!

55hz 444 cone

75hz 1777 cone

When in doubt, and you have a long night ahead of you...alone...with three pots of coffee, or other stimulants (LOL), you can find most of what you need to know on my Greenback ID thread on the TGP forum. Here's the link.

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showth ... adid=67646" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Scumback Speakers wrote:

Mr. Mullard wrote:It goes contrary to what someone posted above....

Oh, just saw neikeel's post....uh...buddy, love you but you've got your cones reversed!
55hz 444 cone
75hz 1777 cone
When in doubt, and you have a long night ahead of you...alone...with three pots of coffee, or other stimulants (LOL), you can find most of what you need to know on my Greenback ID thread on the TGP forum. Here's the link.
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showth ... adid=67646" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yes I saw that and corrected it
Such a clear cut thing too

Does anyone know if the 1777 stamp is put there by Kurt Mueller or by celestion themselves?